Question:
I'm new here and this is my first post, though I have read many, many threads from you all concerning dog food. I just got a dog whose previous owners were feeding her Maxximum Nutrition, which they swear by. I continued her on this food with great results. Shiny coat, few, firm stools, energetic, she eats less, is extremely healthy. The cost is very reasonable and one that I can afford ( a little over $12 for a 20 pound bag). The problem??? All the bad rap you guys give any and every food that is bought at a supermarket or Walmart. Everything is automatically labeled "crap". I see nothing wrong at all with anything about this particular food (the first ingrediant is chicken). It is working extremely well for her. I do love my dog and feel that this is the very best I could do for her and that it is good enough. I mean I also love my kids, but I can't afford to feed them steak and lobster every night! Does that make me a bad parent??? I simply have to get the best quality product that is in my budget. Anyway, just curious about your opinions on this food. Thanks! Here are the ingrediants:
chicken, wheat flour, ground wheat, ground yellow corn, chicken meal, corn gluten meal, animal fat preserved with mixed-tocopherols (source of vitamin e), animal digest, salt, potassium chloride, dicalcium phosphate, calcium carbonate, choline chloride, l-lysine monohydrochloride, zinc sulfate, ferrous sulfate, vitamin e supplement, niacin, vitamin a supplement, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, copper sulfate, riboflavin supplement, vitamin b-12 supplement, pyridoxine hydrochloride, garlice oil, folic acid, vitamin d-3 supplement, calcium iodate, biotin, menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of vitamin k activity), sodium selenite.
crude protein (min) 26.0%, crude fat (min) 16.0%, crude fiber (max) 3.0%, moisture (max) 12.0%, linoleic acid (min) 1.4%, calcium (ca) (min) 1.0%, phosphorus (p) (min) 0.8%
Answer:
I know someone else who feeds this and they say they have good results by it as well. However, there are four grains, including two types of corn, listed before getting to the generic fat, which could come from anything. Cows, chickens, buzzards from the side of the road...euthenized llamas...the problem with cheap foods like this is that you never know what's actually in the bag. Sick/downed animals are a favorite of cheap dog food companies, simply because they can get large quanities of meat very cheap, because they're not fit for even Taco Bell.
Ingredients are listed by pre-processing weight, so the reason chicken is listed first is because prior to actually making it in the food, it weighed more than the next ingredients. The Vitamin K source has been banned in Europe for both pet and human consumption due to various thyroid and liver problems.
I can't afford to feed steak and lobster either, but neither can I afford the vet bills that are likely to arise from feeding a poor-quality food (allergies just for starters...) I dont' like knowing that I'm feeding my dog something that will most likely shorten his life span.
I would be curious to see what you would say/think if you did switch your dogs over to a high-quality food for awhile. They may be doing well on this, heck my dog was doing "well" on Iams, but when I switched him over to Innova, the difference was astounding.
Answer:
I can't afford very high vet bills either, but so far I haven't had to pay any. If I do see that she's having problems with her health later on, and that it's because of her food, then I will look into getting something a little better. But right now I can't really complain.
And hey, what's wrong with Taco Bell?!!! lol
Answer:
I can not give my dogs anyhting with corn in it but if it works for you your the one buying it so stick with it. It jsut seems way over priced for those ingredients.
I feed kirklands and get forty pounds for 16 and no corn.
Answer:
I can't afford very high vet bills either, but so far I haven't had to pay any. If I do see that she's having problems with her health later on, and that it's because of her food, then I will look into getting something a little better. But right now I can't really complain.
And hey, what's wrong with Taco Bell?!!! lol
That philosophy really doesn't make much sense.
Answer:
I can't afford very high vet bills either, but so far I haven't had to pay any. If I do see that she's having problems with her health later on, and that it's because of her food, then I will look into getting something a little better. But right now I can't really complain.
And hey, what's wrong with Taco Bell?!!! lol
I'm sorry but if this is what you think then you cant be very worried about what she eats! What will you do when the damage done is irreversible? also feeding a good food isn't a lot more cheep food is a false economy as you have to feed more
Answer:
What type of dog, how old and how much are you feeding a day?
Answer:
Maxximum Nutrition = an older formula of Purina One packaged as a private label food for Wal Mart. Not a particularly great product.
If you are on a tight budget, see if there's a Costco near you. They sell "Kirkland Signature" food, which isn't quite as good as the true high-ed foods, but it's decent and contains better quality ingredients.
Alternatively, look for Canidae, it's the best bargain among the true premium foods.
Answer:
I have fouind with my own dog that feeding anything with wheat or corn (especially corn) is very, very bad for his health. He came to me with hives all over his paws from beign fed Science Diet at a vet tech school. They fed Science Diet because they got it free from the company.
Um... no thanks. Washing paws, brushing a low maintenance dog several times daily to the dull and dry coat was just not something I'd call fun.
The food i feed now is 2.5 times the bag price of the Science Diet crap, but considering I only have to feed a cup a day I can get it to last me 2.5 to 3 months. More than worth the price of the bag!
On Innova Evo my dog's coat not just gleams it glistens... it's SO shiny that I get a lot of compliments on it. (although (i'm sure the sardines twice a week helps too) He's extremely healthy besides some joint pain and he gobbles that food down so fast i even use it for training. No hives. No problems. No vet bills.
I'd rather know exactly what is in my dog's food, than general labeling - such as "animal fat" or "animal digest." Also I know my dog isn't going to naturally go hunt a field of corn down for a midday snack so evo is definately a bonus. I totally buy the theory that what goes into your dog is what comes out of it. I know that Mojo being on EVO is why he looks and acts so good.
As far as your food. Feed what you want... you are lucky you have a dog that can eat foods like that. But also consider what the per meal price of your food when you look at the bag price.
Answer:
Talk about faulty labelling :rolleyes: How about "Minimal Nutrition."
Charley wasn't all that sold on the quality foods either, feeling they were too expensive, but when I showed him how much of the WalMart/Grocery store brand foods we'd be feeding compared to the Natura, he saw the dollars and sense in it. And now that he's seeing the differences between our dogs and everyone else's, he tells everyone about EVO.
Answer:
You all have to realize that I am a first time dog owner, so I still have a lot to learn. I am not an expert. And I do care about what my dogs eat. Exactly what type of damage are you talking about Gallien Jacks? I wasn't aware that dog food caused fatal damage. A friend of mine fed her dogs purina for years (they lived to be 13 and the other 15 years) and I wouldn't say that it was the food that killed them. If that were the case, I believe they would have died years earlier. Don't you agree?
Mordy- There is no Costco anywhere around here. Is that the only place that sells Kirkland's? It does sound like a good quality food and I will take your word for it since you seem quite educated on the subject. Also, where would I get Canidae? Thanks for the output.
Answer:
Have you been to Mordy's site? www.mordanna.com/dogfood
I think she says it best:
I've always fed __ food to my dog and he did just fine
While there is nothing wrong with feeding a particular food if your dog does well on it and you feel comfortable feeding it, the question is whether you have a basis of comparison and whether the formulation of the food has changed over time. I have seen the effect a better food can have on my own dog. When I adopted him from the shelter, he was a thin little puppy with a brittle coat and a rather strong "doggie odor". I didn't know better yet, fed an average quality food and thought the change in his appearance was stunning, except for the severe reactions he still showed whenever he picked up the occasional flea and got bitten before it died. He had gained weight, the odor improved and his coat was softer and shinier. I was happy and didn't think that any further improvement was possible - until he had been eating a really high quality food for about a month. His allergy to flea bites disappeared entirely, the muscle tone became much more defined, his coat even glossier, softer and most important, much, much denser. The doggie odor vanished.
If I hadn't at least given the better food a try, feeding it long enough to see results (depending on the individual dog this takes about 4-8 weeks), I would still have been convinced that my dog "did just fine" on the lesser quality food. Now I clearly see the difference between "doing just fine" and truly thriving. Every step up the "quality ladder" will bring improvements, the stray dog who used to survive mostly on garbage will do better once he gets a daily ration of even a relatively cheap food because it supplies more essential nutrients; and a dog who was fed a grocery store brand is guaranteed to improve on a better quality product as well.
http://www.mordanna.com/dogfood/index.php?page=myths
Which basically says that while your dog may seen ok you don't know their full health potential until they are on a truly high quality food. And you don't know what will happen in the future and I believe very strongly in preventative medicine. Quality food for dogs, and people, can really help.
Answer:
You all have to realize that I am a first time dog owner, so I still have a lot to learn. I am not an expert. And I do care about what my dogs eat. Exactly what type of damage are you talking about Gallien Jacks? I wasn't aware that dog food caused fatal damage. A friend of mine fed her dogs purina for years (they lived to be 13 and the other 15 years) and I wouldn't say that it was the food that killed them. If that were the case, I believe they would have died years earlier. Don't you agree?
Mordy- There is no Costco anywhere around here. Is that the only place that sells Kirkland's? It does sound like a good quality food and I will take your word for it since you seem quite educated on the subject. Also, where would I get Canidae? Thanks for the output.
Please don't feel that we're jumping all over you, we're not intending to. :) It's great that you're willing to listen and learn and do the best for your dog that you can!
Formulations have changed over the years. For example, IAMS used to be a half-decent food, then P&G bought the company, changed the formula by using lesser quality ingredients, which lowered the price and allowed it to be sold in grocery stores and Wal-Marts. I'm fairly certain feeding Iams is what caused my old dog to get cancer. Many of these lower quality foods are filled with the same active ingredients commerical fertilizers use, some of which are being proven carcinogenic (cancer causing).
To find a Canidae distributor near you, look here: http://www.canidae.com/
Answer:
Kirkland is a Costco private label, so there's no other place to buy it.
To find the place closest to you that sells Canidae, check out the store locator on their website:
http://canidae.com/company/storelocator.html
It's not always strictly pet stores selling food, sometimes feed and farm stores etc. also carry good quality brands.
And I want to second what Zoom mentioned - please don't feel like anyone is attacking you. Actually we are thrilled that you are willing to learn more on how to better care for your dog. :) So two thumbs up to you! ;)
Answer:
Just to reiterate what people have said, canidae isn't to expensive ($35 a 40lbs bag here), and it's much much better than what you are feeding. Without even talking about the menadione (there's an article about it in Mordy's site), the main difference between your food and canidae is that with one you will feed grains, and the other meat... I think the latter makes more sense when feeding a dog. Especially when it's not much more expensive (check the recommended feeding sizes on the bag, you might have to feed less of it too).
My dogs have been on premium food for 8 months now, and I can tell you that not only their hair is shiny, but it is just so soft. And they have no skin problem whatsoever.
Answer:
I used to feed Eukanuba, and thought my dog was very healthy. Shiny coat, etc. He did have a lot of ear problems, but I never connected it to the food.
Then I switched to Natural Balance. HUGE difference! He just gleams. Whenever we go places, I get a ton of compliments on his coat. "He's so soft!" "He's so shiny, did you just bathe him?" "What conditioner do you use on him?" And also, his ear problems disappeared. Turns out he had food allergies that were causing it.
I do understand the money issue. But the Wal-Mart brand isn't very good at all. My vet uses it as an example to teach owners what NOT to feed your dog!
Answer:
What most of us get angriest about, Browneyedgirl, isn't the unknowing dog owners who buy the food, it's the manufacturers who lie to you. And we get a bit irritated at the vets who make no attempt to learn anything different about canine (or feline for that matter) nutrition other than what they are told by the big manufacturers who sponsor nutrition seminars and show them how to sell their expensive, poorly formulated foods to their clients for a tidy profit.
It's not you - you're trying to learn! And that's great. :)
Answer:
My dogs used to eat a junky food. This is before we knew any better, of course. They had rough coats, loose poops. We switched them onto a different kibble (and supplements) and now gorgeous, soft, shiny coats, and firm poops. We feed less, and the food costs less too. Looking at the feeding guidelines of the previous food, I'd have to feed my dogs around 1 cup more each! One bag wouldn't last me a month. With the new food, I spend less, and the amount that I buy in total lasts me a month. I do have to buy a few bags, since I can only get smaller portion bags, but I spend less, feed less, and my dogs are healthier.
Answer:
Okay, guys, I went to costco.com but did not find any Kirkland's. All that was available in dry dog food was Newman's Own Organics dry dog food and Cloudstar Holistic baked dog food.
Anyway, I checked out Canidae but had no luck finding a store within my area code/zip code range. So I went to petfooddirect.com and ordered Canidae chicken and rice formula (6.6 lb bag for $6.92 plus $8.99 shipping). Shipping higher than the food????? This food I can afford, I guess, especially if it's better for her.
I really had no idea that the ingrediants in dog food varied so much. Now I see the difference. Canidae's ingrediants seem much better. I guess the more I learn and research, the better I will be as a dog parent. Thanks!
Answer:
I didnt mean fatal damage, but incorrectly feeding a dog can lead to a lot of health issues, and joint probs especially in the larger breeds
Answer:
If you can't locate a Canidae distributor through their site, call them. They'll be happy to give yout he contact for the closest one near you, and they might ship to you for a better rate.
I don't know where you live, but I have links to a couple sites that sell dogfood online for a reasonable price and you get free shipping.